Being Sore?

I'm relatively new to working out, and I need to know what to consider a workout.


When I do the body by science workout as suggested by Dave, I don't feel it the next day or week even when I go all out.


But when I used to run on the treadmill for half an hour at high speed, I would feel it for a week, and I would run it once a week.

 


Comments

  • suntouchersuntoucher Uninspired Potential ✭✭✭

    Are you getting results?


  • TJ JTJ J skratta pa klocka
    edited February 2013

    Training for 30 plus minutes on a treadmill puts your body in a catabolic state and rapidly depletes your glycogen stores. This will make you sick, lose sleep, and more sore. It has a negative effect on cortisol levels and how your body stores fat. It also requires you to eat more carbohydrates. But how many? Too few carbs and you'll be sore and unhealthy, too many carbs not timed correctly, and you'll get fat and unhealthy.  The correct amount of carbs before/after long cardio sessions can even be difficult for someone with a log journal, myfitnesspal app, and a food scale to gauge. 


     


    edit: And, with treadmill distance running, if you by chance get the perfect amount of glucose at the perfectly optimal time you still spent 30 minutes of your life wasting muscle mass, when you could have burnt the same fat in far less time doing high intensity intervals for 7 minutes  and could have spent the extra 23 minutes meditating.


     


    Body By Science is way to go.


  • Are you getting results?




    Not yet, it's only my 2nd week.. But I don't feel sore sometimes and I'm doing it once every 3 or 4 days..

    I want to know if it's okay not to feel sore, I mean I feel it after I finish the session but not the next day.

  • Training for 30 plus minutes on a treadmill puts your body in a catabolic state and rapidly depletes your glycogen stores. This will make you sick, lose sleep, and more sore. It has a negative effect on cortisol levels and how your body stores fat. It also requires you to eat more carbohydrates. But how many? Too few carbs and you'll be sore and unhealthy, too many carbs not timed correctly, and you'll get fat and unhealthy.  The correct amount of carbs before/after long cardio sessions can even be difficult for someone with a log journal, myfitnesspal app, and a food scale to gauge. 


     


    edit: And, with treadmill distance running, if you by chance get the perfect amount of glucose at the perfectly optimal time you still spent 30 minutes of your life wasting muscle mass, when you could have burnt the same fat in far less time doing high intensity intervals for 7 minutes  and could have spent the extra 23 minutes meditating.


     


    Body By Science is way to go.




    What if I want a larger heart with a lower resting heart rate, I don't want to go slow for 3 hours, it's excellent meditation if you're the right type but unfortunately I am not..


    I thought maybe challenging my heart rate by bringing it about 220 (which can be dangerous and scarring) once a week or so and my heart feeling sore the rest of the week would make it grow I have done no research just a whim xD.


     

  • How many carbs do I have after doing the intense to positive failure Body by science workout? is it okay to do it on the re-feed day or is it just 50 minus fiber and how will this affect intermittent fasting?


    I read that 1g/h of endurance is okay, and if you are doing gymnastics for example or crossfit you can eat up to 3g/h if it's really intense

     


  • M. ThomasM. Thomas A Stick of Butter a Day Keeps the Doctor Away.
    edited February 2013

    Soreness is actually an inflammatory response by the nervous system.  The microtrauma created by the exertion causes the inflammation.  After maybe a few days this microtrauma is healed and the muscles are good to go but the inflammation will still persist.  This type of soreness is an indication of over training.  The body by science approach tries to avoid overtraining so if you are doing it properly soreness should be minimized - as it just focuses on doing exactly enough exercise to fully engage your body's adaptive response.


     


    This is a good piece on muscle soreness that is worth a read: http://www.myosynthesis.com/articles/doms-muscle-soreness


  • M. ThomasM. Thomas A Stick of Butter a Day Keeps the Doctor Away.

    Foam rolling and lacrosse ball tissue massage breaks up the myocardial fascia which is a layer of tissue on top of the muscle. 


     


    On soreness: This tissue is packed full of the nerves that control the motor units in the muscles (but is a separate entity from the muscle itself) and by regularly breaking this up you increase the circulation to and from the nerves which allows for the faster dissipation of the inflammatory cytokines produced by the inflammation. 


     


    On range of motion and trigger points: This tissue layer adheres to the muscle and surrounding structures as well which is what limits the range of motion.  When you use self-myofascial release techniques like this you are breaking up these tissue adhesions.  Adhesions in the fascia do come from exercise, or sometimes the lack of exercise but its the tearing and stretching of the fibers in the fascia - than the body's tenacity to repair them in an unordered manner that causes them to adhere to something in a less than ideal manner.  Knots are a product of inflammation in which the nerves are causing the muscles to remain tense in a focus region (trigger point).  Breaking up the fascia in this area often helps alleviate the point of tension.


     


    I use a lacrosse ball everyday and love it.  This combined with serrapeptase, I would say, is essential for any athlete.


  • M. ThomasM. Thomas A Stick of Butter a Day Keeps the Doctor Away.

    Hah, I didn't disagree but its often thought that being sore is a good thing and sign of growth in the muscle which is really not true.  Inflammation is a necessary evil to a certain point.  This is why NSAIDs (ibuprofren) are bad for gains because limited inflammation is needed to stimulate satellite cells into the area.  There can be situations where the soreness is prolonged much longer than needed, where the muscle tissue is no longer in need of repair but the nervous system is still causing the inflammation to persist due to some kind of over compensation. 


     


    If soreness is a problem you can take protease enzymes and plant sitosterols which in turn effect prostaglandins, the mediators of inflammation.  This is expensive and inefficient though because absorption from oral consumption is very low.


     


    :D Sorrrry I have a lot say about DOMS because I was having problems with it post-holiday this year so I devoted a lot time to figuring out how to fix it.  I guess I just needed to get an info dump out of my system.


  • M. ThomasM. Thomas A Stick of Butter a Day Keeps the Doctor Away.

    Ironically this was just released a few minutes ago:  http://suppversity.blogspot.com/2013/02/no-pain-no-gain-what-can-we-learn-from.html?spref=fb


     


    I am in the process of reading it but the guy over at suppversity is a research beast so I am sure it has some good stuff.


  • MaverickAzzMaverickAzz Powerful

    Wait, so if I just did my first Body By Science workout last night and my muscles are feeling quite sore and "empty" (completely lacking strength) - should I wait a week as suggested in the book or are there a few hacks? I'm about to go and have a cold shower now.


     


    I don't have a foam roller etc


    Looks like I'll have to get one!


     


    I love having animals like you guys on the forum!!


    No sorcery, just science. 

  • M. ThomasM. Thomas A Stick of Butter a Day Keeps the Doctor Away.

    Follow the plan in the book until you understand your physiological responses.  Once you have a feel for how you respond to this exercise implement your hacks.  Nothing wrong with being sore for a few days, inflammation is a good thing..to a certain extent.  There is still a debate as to how necessary soreness is for growth but there is definitely some benefit to it.


     


    I would recommend anyone does self-myocardial fascia relief regardless of soreness.  I just use a lacrosse ball but I plan to eventually get a foam roller.  I don't follow the body by science workout, in fact by the definitions in that book I over train but I do use the information in the book to structure my workouts.  One rule of thumb I picked up that I found useful is that if I can't do more of a certain movement based on reps or weight than I have not given enough time for recovery and over compensation in muscle growth.  This is assuming all the other important factors are relatively consistent too - i.e. sleep, food, other physical activities of the day

  • M. ThomasM. Thomas A Stick of Butter a Day Keeps the Doctor Away.

    good to know.  I just hate how the ball gets wrapped up in my clothes sometimes when I roll on it


  • MaverickAzzMaverickAzz Powerful

    Thanks guys!


    No sorcery, just science. 

  • I was told that it's a good idea to have both the ball and the foam roller.  The ball is good for isolation and smaller spots, but the roller is good to target the larger areas.  That said, the ball does hurt much MUCH more.  (I manage to get through it if I tell myself I am manly as fuck :-P )


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