Advice For A Long Time Vegetarian To Start Becoming Bulletproof

Hello,


 


I was hoping this forum could give me some advice on transitioning from a long time vegetarian diet to the bulletproof diet. I've been a vegetarian for 17 years, and a vegan at different times, so I don't know much about eating or preparing meat, and I don't know how well my body will handle meat again after this long. Can you help? Thanks, I appreciate the help,


 


Stephen 


Comments

  • Probably you'll have initially difficult to digest meat due to lack of enzymes, mostly caused by zinc deficiency and unbalanced zinc/copper ratio.


    You can consider supplementing with zinc and if necessary some betaine HCl with pepsin to assist digestion 


  • Just curious, after that many years of being vegetarian....do you have "moons" on your fingernails still?  My son's moons returned in just a few months of reintroducing meat, after being vegetarian for about 5 years.


  • Parker, I'm not sure what you mean by moons on my fingernails? 


     




    Just curious, after that many years of being vegetarian....do you have "moons" on your fingernails still?  My son's moons returned in just a few months of reintroducing meat, after being vegetarian for about 5 years.




     


  • ACH85ACH85 ✭✭
    edited February 2014

    @PARKER: I've been a veggie for 24 years. If by "moons" you mean the lighter white crescent where the nail grows out of the finger, I've got them. On my ring fingers and pinkies they're there, but mostly obscured by my cuticles. Other fingers have big ones. I've eaten plenty of protein for the last few years though. 


     


    @Smwolfson: Good work, I think I'd be healthier eating meat. If you find any miracle digestive enzymes or anything that has you eating steaks, please let me know. Not that I'm making the switch, but maybe in the future. I can tell you that when I introduced krill oil, fermented cod liver oil (from green pastures), b12, and D3, I had zero trouble whatsoever and felt a bit more energetic. Those cover some basic "really need to get these from an animal source" type nutrients. My logic is that you could add those in right away for an immediate benefit, then ease in to eating meat. By the way, the fermented cod liver oil is for the retinol form of vitamin A, which is something like 20+ times more bioavailable than the plant-based carotene versions.


  • @ach85, Thanks for the info. I actually wouldn't be trying out meat again, if I weren't a little desperate. Over the past few years, I have been feeling progressively worse/lower energy. I also have been getting injured repeatedly and healing really slowly or not at all, so I'm willing to try it out. I'm a moral vegetarian (sometimes vegan), so killing animals for food is a difficult mental barrier to get over. But I figure local grass fed well treated stuff is better than nothing, and I really want to feel better. And down here in Texas it's pretty easy to get high quality grass fed meats. So I'm going to try it out, but I'm pretty nervous and don't really know what I'm doing. Meanwhile, I'll try out the Krill and cod liver oil and see how that feels. 


  • ACH85ACH85 ✭✭
    edited February 2014

    Sorry to hear about the health issues. Have you been tracking macros on your vegetarian/vegan diet? For me, the biggest single change was making sure I got enough protein. I used to be an unhealthy vegetarian, with plenty of pizza and pasta. I was probably only hitting 30-40g protein a day. The recommended daily value for men is 55g I think, but I'd still call that a bit low. For me, adding protein - especially animal proteins - made a huge difference. Literally the first day I did it I had so much energy I couldn't sleep till 5am. I was in the office at 9am and my day still rocked. I'm a man who's ~190lbs, and for me I just don't feel good if I'm not getting 60-80g of protein. Much more if I'm active. 


     


    I'm definitely reliant on animal products. These days I get 50-60g of protein a day from 4 quality XL eggs mixed with the best egg whites I can find. Then ~15-30 more from organic cottage cheese, which is not green on the BP diet but I seem to handle it well. I then add plant-based proteins on top of that for 80-130g daily total protein depending on activity. 


     


    Don't forget b12 - the 5000mcg Jarrow sublingual tablets are actually pretty tasty and many vegetarians are deficient in b12. I didn't mention I also take a K2 pill on top of eating GF butter, which has K2 in it. Do some Googling on common vegetarian nutrient deficiencies, check your diet to see if it may indeed be deficient, and then supplement. Or... 


     


    You could also just spring for some bloodwork. You might have only one or two deficiencies causing all your problems which could be addressed without eating meat. Or, if you had data that showed you absolutely need meat, it would make the moral issue a bit easier to stomach. 


  • @ach85 Thanks again. I appreciate the advice


     


    Stephen 


  • Definitely take it slow, I am sure you didn't go straight into veganism, and much the same your transition back to meat should be gradual. As others have already stated, you will likely have some enzyme deficiencies from not digesting meat products for almost two decades. I would recommend supplementing your diet with probiotics, and eating small bits of papaya or pineapple due to the great digestive enzymes they contain (papaian and bromelain).

  • @phillepedes thank you. I bought some betain hcl on Dave's advice, mostly for the butter coffee, but I'm wary of taking one on an empty stomach in the morning. I'm actually not as worried about digesting the meat as I maybe should be. When I've accidentially eastern meat over the years I've never had problems. For me the two hardest parts are mental and education. It's hard for me to think of myself as a meat eater and even if I did I have no idea what I'm doing as for preparing. And I've been relatively low fat, espeically low saturated fat, that there is a mental hump to get over there as well. But I'm sick of hurting so I'm willing to try at least. So thanks again, everyone.


  • @phillepedes thank you. I bought some betain hcl on Dave's advice, mostly for the butter coffee, but I'm wary of taking one on an empty stomach in the morning. I'm actually not as worried about digesting the meat as I maybe should be. When I've accidentially eastern meat over the years I've never had problems. For me the two hardest parts are mental and education. It's hard for me to think of myself as a meat eater and even if I did I have no idea what I'm doing as for preparing. And I've been relatively low fat, espeically low saturated fat, that there is a mental hump to get over there as well. But I'm sick of hurting so I'm willing to try at least. So thanks again, everyone.





     


     


    Yeah, there's always the internal stigma of "no, I won't eat that, it has meat."


    I learned a while back that if you have no other food, you will eat it. I was at an event where my choices were meat, cheese, and more meat, so I ate some food with cheese and dealt with it. I'd rather eat than not eat, you know?


    It's something that's mental. I would recommend getting to know your local farmers and ensuring that all your meats are humanely sourced, and that the animals at least get to live good, healthy lives before they're killed and consumed. Free-range, organic feed.... actually GOING OUTSIDE. Free-range, btw, can mean being crated in a small cage that is rotated outside. Make sure they get to properly romp around in a large area, it will go a long way in the health of the animal and the consumer of the animal, I assure you.



    Beyond that... if you take all those steps and it still bothers you, maybe just stick with being a vegetarian! *vegan plug* ;)


     

  • I was a vegetarian for over 20 years, and decided last November (for numerous reasons) to adopt a paleo based eating plan. I dived straight in, going from strict vegi to eating gf beef, bacon, chicken and fish in the first week. Although I wouldn't recommend a sudden change In diet, I suffered no ill effects. In fact my energy levels increased, strength went up and after 6 weeks I could see my abs ( even though losing weight was not one of the reasons for the change).


    Interestingly, on two occasions I have eaten bread since going bp as an experiment, and on both occasions have suffered mild stomach cramps and diarrhea.


     


    When I became a vegetarian as a teenager, it was due to a love of nature and to try to minimise my impact on the planet, but ironically eating local, healthy animals and vegetables is a lot closer to the mark than my previous diet of grains, cheap oils and Quorn (*shudder*).


     


    Start off with some slow cooked stews, they can be mostly veg with some beef or chicken, maybe even a few beans (with the view to eliminate over time). Don't go straight into raw meat, offal etc. I have my first order of lambs liver due next week, I have a feeling they are going to be cooked with a lot of other ingredients!


  • SpipsSpips The Chosen Second

    I have an aunt who hasn't had meat since 1983. She's very proud of it, but also wants to follow the BP diet because I've followed it with great results. She'll do everything else, except meat. Not sure how I should handle that, with GF Beef being a staple of the BP diet.


     


    @smwolfson I hope it's been going good for you!


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  •  but maybe in the future. I can tell you that when I introduced krill oil, fermented cod liver oil (from green pastures),




    what is a good source of fermented cod liver oil? brands? thankyou!

  • RekaReka ✭✭✭

    I eat plain cod liver oil, not fermented. What is the difference? Everyone is mentioning the fermented one here, why is that better? How good is the normal plain one?


    It doesn't get easier... It's you who gets better.

     

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  • SkeletorSkeletor The Conqueror Worm ✭✭✭


    I have an aunt who hasn't had meat since 1983. She's very proud of it




    _________


     


    Whenever people brag about stuff like that, this immediately springs to mind.

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  • J-rockJ-rock
    edited June 2014


    I have an aunt who hasn't had meat since 1983. She's very proud of it, but also wants to follow the BP diet because I've followed it with great results. She'll do everything else, except meat. Not sure how I should handle that, with GF Beef being a staple of the BP diet.


     


     




     


     




     


    You can't. Grass-fed meat is part of the deal. Besides, cows eat grass. I eat cow. So I eat grass as well. Therefore I am also a vegetarian.

  • my son was raised as a vegetarian and never had any meat/fish at all, then when he turned 16 he started eating some meat out of his own choice when he went out with friends...he slowly started eating more and more meat....


     


    during his 'transition' to non meat eater to meat eater he suffered with very very frequent 'tummy upsets', almost virtually daily!  this went on for nearly a year!!! he is now fine, he is almost 19.


  • ACH85ACH85 ✭✭
    edited June 2014


    I have an aunt who hasn't had meat since 1983. She's very proud of it, but also wants to follow the BP diet because I've followed it with great results. She'll do everything else, except meat. Not sure how I should handle that, with GF Beef being a staple of the BP diet.




     




     


    See my earlier post. She can't be BP, but can move towards it with eggs and whey protein. Organic cottage cheese for additional protein if she tolerates lactose. Oddly, I handle cottage cheese well but not whey. 


     


     




    what is a good source of fermented cod liver oil? brands? thankyou!




     


    Ha, it was in what you quoted, but I should have capitalized. Green Pasture brand! I do the capsules which don't smell bad and I've never had cod burps. Chris Masterjohn was on the Fat Burning Man show and mentioned a new, unfermented product which seems good as well called Corganic. Video and shownotes here: http://fatburningman.com/chris-masterjohn-good-fats-vs-bad/. Starts with a VERY interesting but in-depth discussion of NSAIDs and inflammation, then around halfway through goes into the history of cod liver oil, then at 36:20 gets into cod liver brands. 


     


     




    I eat plain cod liver oil, not fermented. What is the difference? Everyone is mentioning the fermented one here, why is that better? How good is the normal plain one?




     




     


    In the Chris Masterjohn video above, he goes into detail about the benefits of cod liver oil found in the 19th and 20th century, which were separate benefits. Basically it was used in the 19th century to improve the symptoms of common 19th century diseases. Those were then cured or pretty much under control by 1900, and cod liver oil was applied to common early 20th century diseases. In general, cod liver oil was fermented in the 19th century for storage without spoiling, and not in the early 20th century. So you could go into detail about what you want to fix and whether or not you need fermented (and the 2nd half of the Masterjohn video is a great place to start) but realistically the main benefits of cod liver oil are retinol, D3, and K2, and a good cod liver oil will have those, fermented or not. Chris Masterjohn says that in the video too. But also says he takes Green Pasture fermented.


     


    I believe most of Weston A Price's research used fermented. 


  • SpipsSpips The Chosen Second




     


    You can't. Grass-fed meat is part of the deal. Besides, cows eat grass. I eat cow. So I eat grass as well. Therefore I am also a vegetarian.




     


    Can't argue with that logic. =D

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  • edited January 2015

    After nearly 10 years, I also reverted from vegetarian (lacto-ovo pescatarian actually) back to eating meat, based on the recommendations of this diet.  I'll be honest, I had been wondering for some time about my health and low energy levels because I was basically on a vegetarian junk food diet.  Eating a lot of processed soy products, Quorn (mycoprotein), and beans.  We still ate fish and eggs, with some cheese, but no meat.


     


    Here is what if found when I made the switch:  Based on the book's recommendations, I eliminated all that processed junk food, soy, beans, and cheese.  I have only added Strauss grass fed and grass finished beef.  Ribeye or sirloin steaks, with some ground beef patties also.  I did some research first, and found that taking a DIGESTIVE AMINO ACID COMPLEX a few minutes before eating, with water, is recommended.  I did so, and felt no ill effects.  In fact, I felt great.  And that first steak, man it was so delicious.


     


    The main reasons I stopped eating meat was because of the inhumane way that the animals have been treated, the filthy way they have been processed, and nonsensical grain/waste diet they have been given.  It seemed like straight trash to me.  Now that grass fed and humanely treated beef is more available, I feel ok about integrating it into my diet.  Since I only eat protein once a day (following the rules of trophology where carbs and protein should not be eaten at the same meal)  I've only been eating the beef 2 or 3 times per week.  My other proteins include salmon and (country hen) eggs.


     


    That's my experience, and I hope it helps others make this choice by considering not only your health, but also the ethics of the matter.


  • RekaReka ✭✭✭


    Just curious, after that many years of being vegetarian....do you have "moons" on your fingernails still?  My son's moons returned in just a few months of reintroducing meat, after being vegetarian for about 5 years.




     


     


    What is this with the moons? I've never been anything even close to a vegetarian yet only have moons on my thumbs.

    It doesn't get easier... It's you who gets better.

     

    Is your social worker in that horse?

     

    Success has a price, not a secret.

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